Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon driver

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Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon driver

Post by smile » Mon Mar 04, 2013 10:47 pm

My test have shown that latest printfab 0.91beta with my Canon 6700D prints worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon driver.
PrintFAB please fix this ASAP.
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zedonet
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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by zedonet » Tue Mar 05, 2013 9:02 am

Thanks for posting your measurement results!

I assume that you created ICC profiles for a certain paper using a) the Canon driver and b) PrintFab.

Can you describe your test procedure:

- paper manufacturer & product name?
- if non-Canon inks were used: ink manufacturer?
- which spectrophotometer & which profiling software was used?
- did you import the ICC profile into PrintFab or did you apply it from PhotoShop ("Rendering intent"="No Correction" chosen in the PrintFab driver settings, tab "Color")?

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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by smile » Tue Mar 05, 2013 1:56 pm

Yes the first profile was built with Canon Driver on Windows XP SP3 then with Printfab.

Can you describe your test procedure:
- paper manufacturer & product name?
Lomond Satin XL paper
- if non-Canon inks were used: ink manufacturer?
Inks were from Inktec for CLI-8 cartridges
- which spectrophotometer & which profiling software was used?
Isis XL, i1Profiler
- did you import the ICC profile into PrintFab or did you apply it from PhotoShop ("Rendering intent"="No Correction" chosen in the PrintFab driver settings, tab "Color")?
For canon driver I applied it using Photoshop CS3, for PrintFAB I selected "No color management in Photohop" and applied it using PrintFAB. Color space was AdobeRGB1998

zedonet
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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by zedonet » Wed Mar 06, 2013 9:16 am

Thanks for the quick reply!

With some printers, you can get quite good results with creating a color profile for the manufacturer's Windows driver.

A limitating factor is that often you cannot switch off the manucaturer driver's built-in management, so two layers of color profile lookup tables are applied which usually makes the size of the color gamut smaller (less saturated colors can be printed). This may be no problem for photos but is evident when making proofs for offset printing.

On the other hand, a smaller color gamut can incease color precision as the number of color patches remains the same - the same "grid" of color probes is applied to a smaller "surface" of possible colors.

Can you email me the resulting ICC profiles for comparison (mail at zedonet dot de)?


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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by smile » Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:25 pm

zedonet wrote:With some printers, you can get quite good results with creating a color profile for the manufacturer's Windows driver.
I do not agree, the most important factor is grayscale, but also inklimit is very important too. From reports I made it is clear inklimit provides better gamut size for profiles with PrintFAB, Please fix the grayscale :)
zedonet wrote: A limitating factor is that often you cannot switch off the manucaturer driver's built-in management, so two layers of color profile lookup tables are applied which usually makes the size of the color gamut smaller (less saturated colors can be printed). This may be no problem for photos but is evident when making proofs for offset printing.
Not the case here, I can switch off color management in printer driver without any problems.

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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by smile » Fri Mar 08, 2013 2:13 pm

Have you downloaded the profile, what did you find out?

zedonet
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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by zedonet » Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:35 pm

It seems that I was too slow - the download link says "File is deleted". Could you please email the profiles to mail at zedonet dot com ?

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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by smile » Sat Mar 30, 2013 1:26 pm

zedonet wrote:It seems that I was too slow - the download link says "File is deleted". Could you please email the profiles to mail at zedonet dot com ?
mail sent.

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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by smile » Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:47 pm

Here is comparison for a different profiles made for different paper, but the same happens.
Profiles built for printfab a less neutral than profiles made with canon printer driver
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zedonet
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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by zedonet » Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:30 am

Hello,

thank you for the testing & reporting! I compared the two profiles you sent by mail.
I think we can improce color accuracy with external ICC profiles by adjusting PrintFab's linearization curves so that colors closer to neutral gray are better represented in the profile chart print.

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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by smile » Sat Apr 13, 2013 3:41 pm

Well I think that printing with PrintFAB grayscale should be better than original driver that is the goal any user would use RIP for.
Can you send me download link for updated version so that I can test this?

Does this means grayscale will be optimized for this printer model or for all printers?

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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by smile » Mon Sep 02, 2013 4:58 pm

Well did you fix the grayscale issues withing the latest version of Printfab?

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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by zedonet » Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:26 am

We are wondering why your results are so unsatisfactory. A reason might be that something went wrong in the profile creation process - there are some pitfalls with switching off color correction in the driver first, making sure that the printed chart was not changed by any color management before, etc. To exclude this possibility, we suggest that you print a color chart directly from the PrintFab profile management menues and send it to us via mail. We will create a profile and return it via email. Just enter "forum - smile" in the order field, so you get the profile creation for free.

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Re: Canon6700D worse colors with PrintFAB then with Canon dr

Post by smile » Sat Sep 21, 2013 6:36 pm

We are wondering why your results are so unsatisfactory. A reason might be that something went wrong in the profile creation process


That can't be, my measuring devices are re-certified by manufacturer every year.
we suggest that you print a color chart directly from the PrintFab profile management menues and send it to us via mail. We will create a profile and return it via email. Just enter "forum - smile" in the order field, so you get the profile creation for free.
That would be a last resort, and it does not give me any data.

Why not give the option to let user make linearization and adjust the curves ? I installed new canon driver v2 for my printer, it's not changed just got compatible with windows8. I printed another test chart with gray patches. One version was printed with canon driver as "other photo paper" and the other as "photo paper pro" then using printfab 0.91 beta with ink limit set to 275.

The most neutral is the other photo paper, then photo paper pro, then printfab. Clearly the curves in your driver are not optimized for inks and paper that I'm using. I must have (as everyone else who makes profiles by themselves) a way to adjust curves before printing target.

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